John McCain Survival Probabilities

[Uma Karuna]

Originally Posted by Hilly Nobleman

has the SOA ever done a study on the mortality of elected officials (not just POTUS)?

Are you kidding?

I can't even find published disabled tables more recent than 1980s. And they're Canadian.

[Hilly Nobleman]

Originally Posted by Uma Karuna

One think I really like about Ron Paul is that he opted not to participate in pension programs he was eligible for...he feels he already has enough money and gets a nice salary from the taxpayers.

I would like some more information about this if you have it easily available.

When did he opt out? Are you talking about the pension he gets as an elected official or before?

That seems different then the navy pension McCain started accruing when he was a young man.

I can see the difference between opting out of a plan at the time you were hired (as I assume Paul did) and not electing to receive a pension that you already earned. From what you said, it seems Paul never even earned that pension. I don't even know if legally a participant can opt out of a pension they earned - can they?

[Hilly Nobleman]

Originally Posted by Uma Karuna

Are you kidding?

I can't even find published disabled tables more recent than 1980s. And they're Canadian.

I wasn't kidding, but I knew it was a pie in the sky question. Sometimes the SOA shocks me.

[Uma Karuna]

Originally Posted by Hilly Nobleman

I would like some more information about this if you have it easily available.

When did he opt out? Are you talking about the pension he gets as an elected official or before?

That seems different then the navy pension McCain started accruing when he was a young man.

I think this link is pretty detailed -

http://www.house.gov/paul/press/press97/prjan30.htm

I can see the difference between opting out of a plan at the time you were hired (as I assume Paul did) and not electing to receive a pension that you already earned. From what you said, it seems Paul never even earned that pension. I don't even know if legally a participant can opt out of a pension they earned - can they?

I'm sure the US Treasure would happily cash McCain's checks if he wanted to send his pension back to the taxpayers.

FWIW - it's small....$50k/year, and taxable. But it's kind of the principle of the thing. Yes, he earned it, but he was a wealthy wealthy man when he started to recieve it. You'd think he might discontinue or return it on principle since he clearly doesn't need it.

[campbell]

My grandfather doesn't need his Social Security checks, but he collects them, and signs them right over to his favorite charities.

Perhaps McCain has better things to do with the money he's earned than give it back to the government. If it's buying a boat, that's his business. If it's giving it to charity, that's also his business.

[Hilly Nobleman]

Originally Posted by Uma Karuna

I think this link is pretty detailed -

http://www.house.gov/paul/press/press97/prjan30.htm
I'm sure the US Treasure would happily cash McCain's checks if he wanted to send his pension back to the taxpayers.

FWIW - it's small....$50k/year, and taxable. But it's kind of the principle of the thing. Yes, he earned it, but he was a wealthy wealthy man when he started to recieve it. You'd think he might discontinue or return it on principle since he clearly doesn't need it.

thanks for the information/link. I will read up on that later. Interesting.

I guess that is a matter of opinion, and perhaps I am biased since he is on my team. I guess that would be equal to me getting a check from the gov't for $100/year for the rest of my life. Do I need it? No. Why would I turn it down though? Of course, I am not running for POTUS.

I am still not 100% convinced a participant can opt out of their benefit, but to be honest, I can't come up with a smart sounding reason why. Or really even a half out of my a** reason why. So I think I'll just conceed that point.

[Actuary321]

Originally Posted by Uma Karuna

OK, seriously, probably not.

At this point, I'd guess his morbidity/mortality is about that of others his age...although I might jack it up for the cancer history and the fact that he's running for/may be POTUS, a job that seems to suck the life out of people.

Please note that I'm not an expert in individual underwriting (I'm kind of a hybrid pension/health actuary.)

My post was really more of a dig at the fact that a multi-hundred-millionaire is still collecting a disability pension when he's clearly not disabled.

One think I really like about Ron Paul is that he opted not to participate in pension programs he was eligible for...he feels he already has enough money and gets a nice salary from the taxpayers.

And now if McCain gets elected he will be quadruple dipping.

1. Getting a 50K/year Military Disability pension. (by the way, he would be getting a military pension either way, it may be larger because it is disability but he was going to get the pension anyway because of his years of service.)
2. Senate Pension.
3. POTUS salary (and pension after if he survives)
4. SS currently about 23K.

All this with a wife who earns $432K as CEO of a business and $5+MM from said business.

And people around here complain about school teachers, cops, college professors and other state workers who double dip by retiring and going back to work for the gov.

Originally Posted by Uma Karuna

I think this link is pretty detailed -

http://www.house.gov/paul/press/press97/prjan30.htm
I'm sure the US Treasure would happily cash McCain's checks if he wanted to send his pension back to the taxpayers.

FWIW - it's small....$50k/year, and taxable. But it's kind of the principle of the thing. Yes, he earned it, but he was a wealthy wealthy man when he started to recieve it. You'd think he might discontinue or return it on principle since he clearly doesn't need it.

Actually, most everything I have seen says the Military Retirement is non-taxable. On his website they list it separate because it does not show up on his tax returns.

[Werewolf]

Originally Posted by Actuary321

And people around here complain about school teachers, cops, college professors and other state workers who double dip by retiring and going back to work for the gov.

Because the number of people who can quadruple dip like that can be counted on one hand. Significantly more people with public pensions can double dip.

[Actuary321]

Originally Posted by Werewolf

Because the number of people who can quadruple dip like that can be counted on one hand. Significantly more people with public pensions can double dip.

Maybe quadruple dip only counting Federal money, but I would be a significant number of the Congress critters are at least triple public dippers, if not more.

I would bet my own Congress critter is a quadruple dipper, (though he is probably currently the poorest one in DC) he was a public school teacher, for which I am sure he will soon be getting a pension if not already, a state legislator for which he will get a public pension, and a Congressman for which he will get a public pension plus of course SS.

[twig93]

Originally Posted by Double High C

John McCain's mother is about 95, and from seeing her on TV at the RNC last night, she looks exceptionally good for someone that age.

I was going to say this too - except that I thought she was 96. She does look pretty darned good for a 96 year-old. She looks more like 76 than 96.